MIDDLE AGEish
Authentically and unapologetically keeping it real, discussing all things Middle Age (ish), when metabolism slows and confidence grows. Middle Age(ish): A time of transition from dreaming of who we will grow up to be and looking at the legacy we will leave behind. Listen to this podcast and join the hosts of Middle Age(ish) as they sit around with a glass of wine to discuss all things related to middle age with some amazing guests!
MIDDLE AGEish
Relationships and Authenticity: An Insightful Discussion with Natalie Stavola
In this episode, we had a blast talking with our remarkable guest, Natalie Stavola, a brilliant actress, filmmaker, and dating coach for men. Together, we laugh, discuss, and delve into the complexities of contemporary dating, challenging limiting beliefs, and the importance of self-care, happiness, and understanding the opposite sex.
We have a lot of laughs, but we also venture into more serious terrain as we discuss the cultural limitations imposed on men, particularly around expressing emotions, and the unique challenges of mid-life dating. We also unpack the importance of healing from past relationships, setting boundaries, and the unintentional projections of past pain onto new relationships.
As we wrap up, we explore the transformative power of self-reflection, reframing and reprogramming limiting beliefs and the dangers of comparison in the age of social media. We highlight the essentiality of vulnerability, authenticity, and courage, giving you practical insights into boundary-building, responding to criticism, and trusting yourself. Undoubtedly, this episode with Natalie offers an enlightening perspective on navigating the challenges of modern dating and relationships. So, buckle up for a mind-expanding journey through the intriguing landscape of love, dating, and self-growth.
To learn more about Natalie Stavola, click here.
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Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of Middle Asian podcast. My name is Trisha Kennedy Roman and I'm joined here today with my cohost, ashley Badowski, lisa Kelly and Dr Pam Wright, and we are really looking forward to this evening. It's going to be a great night because we get to be joined in just a little bit by Natalie Stavola. She's an award winning actress, a filmmaker, and also has a background in psychology and is a life coach and dating coach for men, so this should be a really interesting conversation. She has a really diverse background. I guess we had a lot of fun, so much fun.
Speaker 2:This is totally the opposite way around. I know Like a dating coach for men.
Speaker 3:Right, Like it's kind of cool. And I do Like I think that's going to be something that our listeners want to hear about, because we're looking at it obviously from a female perspective, right. But yeah, to hear what guys Men want, right, i mean I kind of I kind of feel like we kind of know sometimes what they want. However it would be like it's going to be an interesting perspective.
Speaker 5:What was the weird? Remember the book like a long time ago, was it the rules or whatever? And they were like oh, don't call after Yes.
Speaker 3:I've heard about this. Wait, was that the not men or from No, that's one too, But this one was more like.
Speaker 5:these are the rules There's an actual rules You have to like you know call them after two dates, or you make them wait 48 hours to call them. That kind of thing. So I wonder if she's like got these rules that she got.
Speaker 2:And I heard like a millennial the other day talking on the radio and he was saying you know, and she texts back and she didn't even use an exclamation point. I was like what?
Speaker 1:Did I use words now.
Speaker 2:It's like apparently, though there's there's like hidden things, that if you use an exclamation point in the text, it means more. or if you do dot dot dot or don't say this or don't say that, i would say that would terrify me, because we've all seen my text messages and I love emojis.
Speaker 4:I know.
Speaker 2:I love the exclamation point and the dot dot dot Yep, i love those.
Speaker 1:I mean.
Speaker 4:I just I do.
Speaker 3:It just makes my heart happy and I get all, but so we already sending a message.
Speaker 5:Lord knows, there's no hidden message.
Speaker 3:I'm just making myself happy and giggling and thinking I'm super funny, that's amazing.
Speaker 1:Be careful with your emojis. You might not know what you're sending.
Speaker 5:Yeah, this is true. I agree, i, i'm, i'm an emoji person.
Speaker 3:I, I, I mean, I freaking love them. Like I mean, i could send in an entire text message just with emojis, and you would completely understand And you would understand what I'm saying, and you would get like you would get the gist of my message.
Speaker 5:That's terrible, I see I'm like so worried about what you've been sending.
Speaker 3:I know I need to.
Speaker 5:Oh gosh. As the psychologist people feel like what does she want me to do?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you never go send the eggplant emoji.
Speaker 1:She no I don't know, i do know. Or donuts. Don't send donuts, it's only the smiley With the eggplugs. I don't, we only send mostly the smiley.
Speaker 5:I do send a lot of hearts. Yeah, I do heart smiley.
Speaker 3:I do do the angry face sometimes.
Speaker 4:I do the eye roll, i do the eye roll, i do the eye roll.
Speaker 5:Yeah, when I don't want to say just what?
Speaker 3:the oh, oh, yeah, yeah, i'll do that. No, i don't do the eggplant. I don't think I've done a donut.
Speaker 5:I send the poop emoji a lot to my family. Oh yeah, I do that too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I usually just do shit.
Speaker 2:I send the middle finger as well. I usually just say the F word.
Speaker 5:I know My poor family, my poor mom.
Speaker 3:I mean, she really tried so hard Poor mom too. I mean she really did try so hard to make I know Anyway, yeah. so I just usually kind of spell that stuff out. However, if I don't know the person well enough, then I'll send the poop emoji and the finger and see if they like respond back. And then I can just be like right, okay.
Speaker 5:so what does an explanation point mean? I don't know.
Speaker 2:You didn't say what it meant, but it sounded like I think they were they were talking about. Somebody had text and said okay, see you then. It was like he was. He was suggesting that she was ghosting him And when he asked her, did you want to go for a drink? She said okay, see you then, but didn't put an exclamation point afterwards to kind of say that she was excited to do it. I was like this is so complicated.
Speaker 3:Okay, first of all, that's reading way too much.
Speaker 2:I was like, i know, we know, like how hard it is to like, how stupid it is to read into text as well. Okay, so eggplants.
Speaker 5:That's, that's the male genitane Male yeah.
Speaker 2:So if you send that, don't send it. Don't send eggplants As a general rule. Thank God Corbin isn't here tonight.
Speaker 5:Yeah, so what other? what other emojis should we be aware of, since Ashley and I The donut eggplant.
Speaker 3:What other ones?
Speaker 1:I think those are the two main ones.
Speaker 2:It's just kind of Japan's the area where you put them in, with Like huh, ever changing. I kind of imagine dating now, though.
Speaker 3:It's just that is a crazy part about being in this age group is, yeah, that it's got to be so different, though The rules, like everything has to, be like crazy different.
Speaker 1:Are there even rules? now I?
Speaker 5:don't know if there are any rules. Well, clearly, there's emojis. That are emojis.
Speaker 3:I know Cause. Don't you remember when we were all dating, like you would have the first base, you would have the second base?
Speaker 5:There's no bases now.
Speaker 3:There's like I mean, i do listen to some of my single friends and I'm always like you, did what, like hold on, wait, what Cause? I'm still like, my mind is still stuck in 1980s, like that's where my you know. I mean that's when I dated. I mean so, that's where my mind is. That's why I would be the word of there's many things why I would be the worst person to date. but I'm still stuck on first base, second base, third base, and then there's the home run. Yeah, we don't have those.
Speaker 2:No, there's no bases anymore. No, no, I wouldn't think so It's just you strike out.
Speaker 5:are you home run?
Speaker 1:Yes, We get to find out the rules now, because we have our guests Oh here we go, All right we're excited. We will now be joined by Natalie Stavola. She is an award-winning actress, a filmmaker and has a background in psychology, and we are really excited too to talk to her about her life and dating coach experience. And she does that for men, so this is kind of a different aspect for us, because a lot of times we're focused on women, so it'll be interesting to hear your viewpoints on that.
Speaker 4:The flip side Yes, the flip side of that. So welcome Natalie. I'm excited to have you here, so excited to be here. Thank you guys for having me on today. It's a very impressive resume. It is.
Speaker 2:It's a lot of things.
Speaker 4:I know I feel like I'm an underachiever. Yeah, no, no, no, one of my limiting beliefs that I'm breaking is that my worth isn't what I do And I. Sometimes you burn out when you overdo that. Yeah, joy and happiness is really important, sometimes overworking Yeah, i think we learned that later on in years Yeah.
Speaker 3:What came first?
Speaker 4:the acting, the coaching, you know, i think it might have actually come together at the same time, because both of them have a lot to do with each other. I grew up in a household where, you know, filmmaking, things like that, weren't something that your parents really wanted to push you towards, because you know they were scared that you wouldn't make me. Yeah, we all do that. So for me, actually, i kind of hid the fact that I was acting and I was doing like little things on the side when I was in college, but, you know, there was a running joke that my whole family thought that I was going to be a surgeon, actually, and a doctor, and that I was going to be a broke surgeon because I had such a bleeding heart.
Speaker 4:I was constantly helping others. The thing, though, is that I was always helping people at the detriment to myself, and when I finally learned how to actually do the work do the inner work have boundaries is when, all of a sudden, you know, i got to speak up, become an actor, be a filmmaker, jump into that, and at the same time, i was helping others doing that, started looking at counseling and then wound up finding out about coaching and dating coaching and life coaching And yeah went down there. That's amazing, yeah Is that right It is.
Speaker 4:but I will say this I'm helping the men and it helps us.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, absolutely. It's a genius move.
Speaker 2:It really is. This is for us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I do coach women too.
Speaker 4:I actually do have some clients that are women. It's just that as I put things out there and as I've gone through my own life journey, it just so happens that a lot of things that I've been through and a lot of things that I've gone through in life and overcome in life, it's kind of made me uniquely qualified to So help men out and see a little bit more of their journey. I don't walk as a man, I'm not a man, I don't have that but I can bridge the gap.
Speaker 2:Which is always nice. Yeah, I mean, it's the best of both worlds really. Especially because you can give things from a female perspective to men as well, which is invaluable to you, which I think is what they need.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely Yeah, that's what they've been asking for?
Speaker 2:What are some of the hurdles that men seem to be facing, cause I just always believe it's a much easier world for them in the dating world. It's just, but I know women have become way more assertive than they would have been a couple of years ago. I know a little bit more of what they want. But like what are the major hurdles for men? You?
Speaker 4:know, what's so funny is that we all have some of the very same limiting beliefs and or same perceptions. I should say A lot of men oftentimes actually think that it's easier for women and that they don't have to Really. Wow, Because they think that women, just we just get to sit here and people approach us and that we don't get rejected at all. They think that women don't get rejected. We're like what?
Speaker 3:All the time. Oh, that's interesting. We wear makeup. What are you talking about? I know Like what?
Speaker 4:So? a lot of the things that I mostly hear, and they're bigger, the bigger hurdles. A lot of cultures and countries tell men that they're not allowed to have emotions and that they're only allowed to experience anger and hunger. That's it. Oh, wow, and here's what happens. As women And I'm not gonna lie, i've done this too, because I had to heal and I didn't know any better I projected my perception and my pain from men on to good men.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Oh, yes, yeah.
Speaker 4:Right Where I didn't realize too that you know, men have been taught to suppress their emotions and then, when they have tried to come out and actually speak on the fact that they are a human being, they have emotions. There's a lot of women who have shamed men back into just being quiet, shutting down more trauma. So the biggest thing, i think, is that men actually opening up and learning how to feel safe and speaking on their own boundaries, because, guys, they're so afraid of losing us too.
Speaker 4:They want a relationship, they want a family, they want to fit in with their guy friends, they want to feel attractive and desired And oftentimes cultures and countries have taught them no, be quiet. And then, as women, have stepped up into our power, thank goodness. Sometimes we've gone a little bit too far and we've opened up. And then what happens when we first start opening up to our own trauma, as we get really loud about it and we project it for a little bit until we heal it And we can wind up going be quiet, men. It's a woman's turn And we're basically perpetuating the same exact thing that hurt us in the first place. Yeah, just men not processing their emotions and showing up, you know, with us in that. That's the way to my heart Show me emotion.
Speaker 1:I know, yeah, shut it to your Yeah.
Speaker 4:She can't wait to show my men this.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I was going to say So what do you think is different in middle age for men, like in dating, because we were talking about before, we would have a hard time going to this generation starting over, you know, in dating, versus like what we knew back in the 80s 90s, 2000s.
Speaker 3:Yeah, like some of the men that are kind of like like the flip side of us, that they've been with their partner for a long time and they're getting back out there, yeah, Yeah, so a lot of it is.
Speaker 4:You know, as we've aged, gracefully and lovingly and wonderfully, we've learned what works for us and what doesn't work for us. The thing is, though, is that we still have to heal. We don't have to, but I would recommend it. You still want to heal from the things that hurt us so that we don't unpack that in the next relationship. Right, men have to do that too, so oftentimes, i mean, it doesn't really matter which generation you're from. We all have limiting beliefs. You all have things that we're going to overcome.
Speaker 4:It's just that, yeah, is there more online dating and is there more social media and things like that. That can hinder us? Sure, but we had our own social engagements back in the day, too, where you know there was bullying, a belittling or comparison, all of that, so I think a big part of it is that, once you've gotten out of a relationship or you're single, you know you're going through a divorce. It's learning how to forgive and let go and heal, and then kind of start that process in of like, what did I like about how I showed up, what could I do differently, and then what are my boundaries and what are the things that I will not tolerate again in the next one. But we want to heal that so that that way we don't get triggered by it and continue to kind of stay around it and accidentally date it. So mostly that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, because I do like I know that you've repeated multiple times like about the importance of not repeating a cycle, and I think that we've talked about friends that are have gone through divorce and they're single and they're moving forward, but they seem to be in that cycle of there, like they like subconsciously pick out the same person that they basically just divorced Yeah.
Speaker 3:And so I think it's so important because, like I said, i mean I see it with my friends. I'm like you just divorced that personality and now you're dating it again. So I love to hear, like you know, how you work and focus on that, because again, like I said just speaking from my friends, breaking that cycle, i feel like you have to make a conscious effort and decision to do it or you're going to slide right back into it A thousand percent.
Speaker 4:The thing is is that it's hard Sometimes. We will all repeat cycles. There's some cycles and patterns that I've repeated, even though I'm aware and I've been aware. I'm not going to say when I got my college degree.
Speaker 3:That's okay. We don't talk about our age either.
Speaker 4:Even with awareness. Awareness is wonderful, but you'll watch, because our subconscious mind is much more powerful than our conscious mind.
Speaker 4:So, even if we become aware that just becomes more frustrating, you're like, no, i'm doing another narcissist Again. What winds up happening is that. It's a good thing, though, because relationships are mirrors everyone career relationships, family relationships, romantic relationships, everything, friendships all a mirror. It helps us to see what's going on in our subconscious and what we need to heal next, to step up and elevate to the next level of our lives. Relationships, oh yeah, and it'll help you too. Anything that you're unblocking in a relationship will directly help you with career as well. That's what it's meant for, so you'll find your patterns If you're still dating the same type of person. It's usually a childhood wound, something that has to do with your mother or father, and a programming or a limiting belief that kind of got instilled, or generational trauma that got instilled when you were a kid. So you're going to keep doing that until you break it, until you heal it.
Speaker 5:I'm a psychologist and I look at amalgotherapy. I mean, there's a lot of great therapies but amalgam like going back to past and looking at what happened with your family that makes you who you are today and has, like, all these different opinions about people and men and dating or women and dating So it's just all these like patterns from the past and you have to look at it. But I think a lot of times, like you were saying too, people want to rush into the next relationship versus let me take the time to think and heal and really learn. What were the red flags, what do I learn from that? What do I need to do differently? But amalgam, i think, helps a lot in going backwards.
Speaker 4:Yes, absolutely. I mean, don't get me wrong Everyone's healing journey after a relationship is different, for the timeline, for sure, but if you're doing a repeat pattern and it's again and again, and again, then that means that there's some excavating to do. It's. The one thing, though, that happens is you'll see a lot of us in the healing community that we're like oh my God, healing is amazing. Healing is wonderful. You're going to love it on the other side, and then you sign up with us when you're like you're going to cry like a little child.
Speaker 3:It's going to hurt for a while before you get to the positive and the happy stage.
Speaker 4:And sometimes right when people hit that stage where they're finally getting to the meat the meat and potatoes of like man, i am hurting because my whole life people have been belittling me, condescending me, disrespecting me, manipulating me stemming from my childhood Right when we get there. That's why you want to work with a therapist and a coach, work with both and it's like MWAH money. Only people you trust. I got them out. Date them. Do basically not, really don't date your therapy.
Speaker 5:We know what you mean.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we got it.
Speaker 4:But right when you're getting there, a lot of people can get very scared because it's emotions and most of the time people are just so afraid of those feelings And I promise it only lasts for 20 minutes Like you'll feel some sadness and then it passes and then it's like this, this weight off your shoulders. If anyone's struggling with like IBS or skin rashes or problems with their body, their body shutting down, problems in their back or their neck, it's usually because your tension in your body, you're holding on to those things, but we're just so scared to like go through it because the emotions scare us. But once you do, it's like you're gonna have to repeat that ever again. Yeah, i think it is.
Speaker 3:We don't want to hurt, like whether it's physical, emotional, it's easier just to like skim over it and then just breeze through it, and so I think that that's super positive to like just reinforce that to get better. rather, it's like you were talking about physical you know whether you whatever is going on with your body or emotional it hurts before it gets better.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, and that right there is the one that you've got to push through, and I think that, just as humans, we tend to shy away from anything that makes us uncomfortable, anything that hurts us. It's almost like that subconscious, like you said, it's our protective barrier. Like I'm good, i've got the bullet points.
Speaker 1:You know My husband's probably listening to this thing and I wish that Trisha kind of held back her feelings a little bit more.
Speaker 3:I know I don't think that he thinks that it.
Speaker 1:I'm not mad. you're going to know it and I'm going to show it, and so I definitely. I am one who expresses my emotions And see, i'm just the opposite.
Speaker 3:I'm either happier pissed. I feel like you know I need to continue to grow because, again, i'm happier pissed. Those are the emotions. But if you get me talking, like where that little girl that you know, that hurt or like that fear or whatever, oh my gosh. So like I'm still doing it at 51, where I'm like trying to bust down those walls, that's why I could talk about it, because it is uncomfortable to open up that door, because you're like I'm so much better just being happier pissed.
Speaker 4:A lot of times we're afraid that we'll get stuck there, because what'll happen first is we'll push that down, which can cause so many problems in our body, and then, and not only that, your partner wants to know what's going on and not mind read. And then what happens after we open up is the floodgates come out, and then we're like what?
Speaker 3:And then you're like, how do?
Speaker 4:I pull that back. How do I? pull that back, what's just happening And it's just the fastest way is through, and then you start learning how to process it and you start learning how to just feel it for a second and then be able to communicate it when you go back to like a homeostasis or like a neutral So I'm Irish, italian You're gonna feel my emotions, cause I feel them, and then I'm gonna be angry about them and then I'm gonna shut down. So we had some things to relearn growing on you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was a quote in Sex and the City last night about it. Tony Danza was in it. They were at an Italian restaurant and he was saying he's Irish Italian too. He was saying, basically, that Italian is just Irish with better food. Oh, i was like, hmm, we'll see.
Speaker 4:Yeah, i have a lot of similarities. All the women are very similar.
Speaker 2:Oh my goodness, i literally just had this conversation with somebody saying that Irish and Italian women are exactly it's the exact same. The women are the head of the house and that, like what we say go Passionate fiery. Passionate, fiery, but not very emotional. I would say I know it's a bit of a generalization but it's very much like you. gotta keep the face. Keep the face, just get through it, Don't talk about anything.
Speaker 4:I think our family units kind of passed that down, because I know I'm third generation Italian, fifth generation like Irish, but like that's like when you're in those communities, especially when they came over in like the 1900s, you kind of passed on that generational familial type of structure where it was like women suppressing one women out, shout out in the other. Both of them love food. The things that one could do with pasta is the other one could do with potatoes. You know what I mean. Yeah.
Speaker 2:We have a question for you. I have a question for you. One of our listeners here, natalie, wanted to know what your take is on the concept of rewriting your childhood narrative in order to make or find the narrative to live by as an adult. Oh, i love that, oh, wow that is a good one.
Speaker 4:That's wonderful. Now, i'm not sure on the words and the verbiage of like rewriting, because I think you call a spade a spade. You know what I mean. I think the first thing is we have a tendency in this culture to bypass a lot and go. You shouldn't think like that, you shouldn't look at your mother and father that way And it's like we kind of gaslight ourselves when we do that, as opposed to, there's no loss of love when you go. Hey, some things happen in my childhood. Not okay with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, we can reframe it.
Speaker 4:We can reprogram it and we can re-parent it. One wonderful way to do that, too, is like you can do an exercise where and I do recommend working with a therapist and a coach on this you can walk back and go to that initial memory. Let's say that, for instance, one of your limiting beliefs that keeps leading you to toxic relationships is I'm not good enough, or I'm not pretty enough, something like that. You know something, anything, but I'm not good enough is a big one. What winds up happening is you'll keep choosing partners that make you feel like you're not enough because our subconscious mind is very simple.
Speaker 4:It's designed to keep you right in order to keep you safe. Simple as that. So if you walk that back, you can journal, it, go to your, which helps you access your subconscious and you find out. All right, brain, show me when's the first memory, When's the first time that that came in? And it's usually from the ages of two to 10 up to 14. When's the first time that that got planted in, that I'm not good enough? And then you find out. you're like oh man, when I was younger, my parents had a, you know, my sister or my brother, and they paid more attention to him or her, And they didn't mean to, but that's how I received that.
Speaker 3:That I wasn't enough.
Speaker 4:So now you go back into that. You do like a little meditation. Go back into that memory, show up as the you today or pull in someone that you feel safe with into that memory. Explain to your younger self what's going on. If you need to yell at anyone, yell at them. If you need to cuss them out, cuss them out. You can do that. It doesn't change the memory, but what it does is it changes how you feel about the memory and how you interpret it. And, like, tell your younger self like yo, when we get older oh my God, we have a car, we have a house, we got this.
Speaker 3:It'd be amazing.
Speaker 4:Oh right, you yell at people and they let you. You don't yell at them.
Speaker 2:Not well You do try to see.
Speaker 1:Well, I do Yeah.
Speaker 4:So nice. And then what winds up happening is that whenever someone is around you ever again who elicits that trigger, that ping in you of like, oh, i don't feel like I'm good enough, i need to prove myself to this person, you're gonna pause and you'll know the memory and where it comes from and you're gonna reframe it. I'm like, no, i am good enough. My parents, like, had a young child and I received it this way, but that's you know what. I don't treat other people that way. I don't deserve to be treated that way.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:It's a no me, thank you. That's a boundary. I don't play with people who make me feel like I have to prove myself Next.
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, that's amazing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's another question here, actually, which is really interesting as well Who's most likely to try to hold on to a relationship, men or women, in your experience, who do you see, wants to hold it more together? Equal, equal parts, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:You have. I think it's just such a lie that that we've told ourselves and passed on that men are X, y and Z and they don't care and they don't want to be part of the family. The most healing thing that's ever happened to me was stepping into the space and coaching men and seeing how many men are like. That is not my truth. I want marriage. I show up. There's so many men that their fathers weren't there for them and they want to be there And they'll wind up if they don't heal. They'll wind up accidentally choosing women who leave or shut down or dismiss them. It works both ways. And when I saw that and I realized I'm like, oh my God, we are in this together.
Speaker 3:But I think that that is such an amazing message because I've always thought that you know, like the men this way, women this way, And so just having that moment of clarity that, okay, you know what They're probably thinking the same thing that we are It's just that they verbalize differently, they handle their emotions differently, but it doesn't mean that their emotions are different, right?
Speaker 2:And I think to be fair, most of us don't have a huge wealth of experience in different relationships.
Speaker 4:Right.
Speaker 2:That's the other thing. So, like, how are you supposed to know what's normal? And like I always think about this, i'm like you're both raised in completely different families, different ways, different things, and then you're kind of thrown together and expected to make the work, make it work And it's like how like my husband's from Australia and I'm from Ireland like our growing up years could not have been more different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's just it's. I constantly go like how are you supposed to make that work? sometimes Right, because it's so different as well, and like I didn't have that many relationships. But you know, you then compare to the relationship you had before and you're like it's just so, it's so hard, it's so hard And it's so hard to know what's right and what's not right.
Speaker 4:Yes, i usually tell people this because sometimes people will get scared if they're like, oh my God, i'm dating someone and it's not perfect, it's not supposed to be.
Speaker 3:Right, it's not perfect.
Speaker 4:Right. What we're doing is we're finding people friendships, family members, career, especially, romantic partners. We're finding people that we're safe to make mistakes with Yeah, That we have each other's back, yeah, and people that are willing to work together, like I know.
Speaker 2:You've always said this, ashley. you're always saying it's a job.
Speaker 4:It is a job.
Speaker 2:It's like it is. It's constant work and every day is not going to be perfect And some days will be a little bit better than others and then other days won't be. But like that's kind of life.
Speaker 3:It is like that You learn together, yeah, but it's like you were saying, lisa, like when we got married I mean I know, i was 22, right out of college, we didn't live together. Before You throw us together, we were raised completely different And you're just like, well, it needs to be perfect, it's supposed to be great. And if it's not great, it's not perfect, then this is not meant to be like oh, this is a sign.
Speaker 3:Yeah, this is a sign I'm not. I picked the wrong one, and so, yeah, it is actually amazing that you can cohabitate and grow, cause, like that's what I've always said too, like you either grow together or you grow apart.
Speaker 4:Those are your only two options.
Speaker 3:Like you can't stay stagnant, Like it just doesn't. That's not how life is meant to be And so, yeah, like it's, it is kind of a job.
Speaker 3:Like you got to wake up, you got to give it a hundred percent. You got to take the hits when you're not Physically. But yeah, not that, not that, no, no, but like you take the head and indicate like today wasn't great, we didn't communicate well with each other, but you know what, tomorrow I'm going to try and be better and I'm going to verbalize better. So that's your teammate. I know Like it is your ride or die.
Speaker 5:You know and just do. That, though, is the same team, because a lot of times, like my clients will come in and be like, oh, but if I have to tell him to say he loves me or that I'm pretty or whatever, that it negates everything, and I'm like no, he doesn't read your mind, he doesn't know exactly. You need what you want. Saying what you do or what, it doesn't mean you're going to necessarily get it, but you still have to, like, express how you feel and what your needs are, and then see what's reciprocated?
Speaker 3:Yeah, because guaranteed he's thinking something totally different, of course.
Speaker 4:By the way, that happens with men too, and usually the reason why it continues to happen is because if you're not meeting your own core needs, then it doesn't matter how many times your partner says I love you or you look great, or oh my God, maybe you look amazing in that dress, you're not going to feel it because you're actually disrespecting yourself or you're not nourishing and honoring yourself. So it becomes like a bottomless pit. So that's why you feel empty when you ask for it, because even if you didn't, it just you're going to need more and more, and more and more and more because you're not standing in front of the mirror. I love you, i like that outfit.
Speaker 5:Your butt looks so good today.
Speaker 4:So it's never enough, like it never is enough. Catch yourself in the mirror and in the reflection and go oh my God, like that, do that for yourself And I guarantee you're going to. You're missing, because what happens is when we're not giving it to ourselves, we're actually going to miss when our partner is actually giving it to us, and then we'll feel like it's not enough. If you start meeting those core needs, you're going to watch and notice that your partner is doing it, or is saying it or you'll get it more.
Speaker 3:He's sincere when he says it, like that's the thing, like sometimes you know they'll say it and you're like you don't mean it because you're like you, like you just said because you're not like, we're not feeling it personally, So they may be saying it Yeah, they may be saying it with sincere intent, but we will hear it as your. Whatever You're just lying. Yeah, move on, yeah.
Speaker 4:By the way, that's one of the biggest keys to manifesting too. If you want something, the fastest way to get it is by feeling it inside of you too.
Speaker 4:So that works with relationships, career, everything. The unblocking comes in when you hear voices in your head that say things like no, no way, that's not true, blah, blah, blah. That's when you want to unblock and heal those things. But the fastest way to receive what you want and what you're looking for, what you deserve, what you absolutely deserve, is by feeling it inside of yourself first and actually giving it to yourself first.
Speaker 1:You know we've talked a lot about comparison and social media and different things like that which we can do to ourselves. But I know too, and I've been guilty of this, like even when you watch TV shows like Armageddon, like no one's done the animal cracker thing.
Speaker 4:Where's my boombox outside? But?
Speaker 1:it's so hard to. I think, you see, it's so easy to watch movies and to watch TV shows And I mean you're an actress you know like, and so I think it's so easy, not just with social media. But comparison to where you're like my house doesn't like this, my relationship doesn't like this, you know. So I think that comparison can be hard on ourselves but hard on our relationships too.
Speaker 2:Comparisons the thief of joy.
Speaker 4:Yeah, comparison is the thief of joy, it is. That one is so important And, by the way, i get Lisa.
Speaker 3:I have to get that old shirt. I love that.
Speaker 4:It's so good, but it's so true, and I do it too. I have things that'll happen where I watch people you know have a career that I want, or whatever. Envy is not a bad thing. You want to integrate that, because the more that you go, if I'm envious of this, that means I'm off alignment, i might not be doing something that actually matters to me. So Envy shows us that it's possible and that that's actually. We can integrate that. And also when it comes to movies, that is a 90 minute movie. They're trying to show you two strangers coming together and getting married.
Speaker 3:It is a lie, it is a lie.
Speaker 4:That is codependent, that is not healthy, that is not how you do it.
Speaker 2:But I think the problem, though, now is that's reinforced by social media. So you have all those people out there putting up something that their husbands are doing and you're going oh my God, so it is the same in the movies and I don't have that.
Speaker 3:Well, everything looks perfect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, i mean yes, yeah.
Speaker 3:Everything looks perfect, and that is just not life.
Speaker 4:Nope, no, i've loved people who have kind of been more authentic. I follow a lot more people who are more authentic with things, and even I try to too, like if I'm going through something I'll try and heal from it a little bit first, so it's not spitting out any venom. But I'll be authentic on things like hey, i'm not feeling the best, i've struggled with body dysmorphia and not feeling beautiful and growing up feeling like a ugly duckling and all kinds of things or trauma or whatever, and so I really value when people and not everyone has to do it. But I really value when I see people that are like, hey, i'm going to be honest, i have anxiety, right.
Speaker 3:I mean life is perfectly imperfect.
Speaker 4:That is like I mean, if you take the shades off.
Speaker 3:I mean it is like life is perfectly imperfect, and that's how it's supposed to be.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because that's how you grow in my opinion, yeah, so one thing I love about this podcast, though, is that I think it's made us be kind of more open about you know. We're making things real, because a lot of people might be experiencing certain things, but they feel like it's just them, and I think that that's one thing. I think we're all being a little bit more vulnerable, talking about issues we have, so that other people can hear those and think, well, i go through the same thing, and then having you know great guests to talk to us about those same things, and say, hey, i go through it too, you know.
Speaker 4:Oh, my God, i love it.
Speaker 3:We're the flip side of the social media, where everything is perfect Yeah. You know, I mean, that's what we've tried to like. We talk about is like life is a struggle. It's never been meant to journey by yourself, but you got to speak your truth, you got to be honest, you got to help someone else along the way. It's we talked about it all the time.
Speaker 4:It's a bridge. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3:Got one on the other side of the bridge who's gone through it and is confident and is willing to step back and look across the bridge and pull somebody over it that is struggling, and I think we need more of that, just like you were talking about, like just being honest, being raw, because there are a lot of people who suffer in silence.
Speaker 4:Yeah, Mm-hmm A lot. I think it's the core, too, that I love, and I think one of my clients got it tattooed on his arms one time. It's permanent now. Courage is not the absence of fear. It's moving forward in spite of it, because of those fears.
Speaker 5:Yes, correct, yeah.
Speaker 4:There's no way you're going to live life without fear. That's impossible.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:When it fear helps us indicate, like what's meant for us, what's not meant for us, and when you're close to something that's important to us.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 4:So we need it. It also is like you know what I mean Stove hot. You're going to need to know when things are like bad, or When they're going to hurt you.
Speaker 3:Yes, like you have those signals when it's actually going to hurt you in any way, so that you learn there's those boundaries. You're like, oh, i can't touch that or I can't do that, i'm going to get hurt, you know. So I think, yeah, i think I think it's important.
Speaker 4:Also, too, what we were talking about with healing, the reason why healing with a little bit of the journey of it hurts. The main reason is that so that that way, when you get through it, you never go back there again.
Speaker 3:You don't forget.
Speaker 4:Yes, Exactly, Because if it didn't, you'd be like la la la, look at this toxic person, I'm going to jump on them.
Speaker 3:Yeah, i can move right through it. It's not going to hurt me. I'm not going to have any pain.
Speaker 2:I've done this before, yeah.
Speaker 3:It's fine.
Speaker 4:Pain is an indicator of like move Stop going there Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's why that's why, with being an actress and being in the public eye and in the entertainment industry, was it hard for you to be able to talk about your vulnerabilities and to not be fake about it? Was that hard for you, or did that come naturally?
Speaker 4:to you? Yes, but my experience with it was a little interesting. I grew up without a filter. I did not know how to speak to people. I actually studied that in college because I would open my mouth and I would lose friends, because I had no inflection or like joking. I was just so socially awkward. I wore thick glasses, My nose was always in a book. I skipped school because I was like I was such a nerd. I had like a 3.9 weighted GPA and I lived by an ocean when we moved from Connecticut to Florida. So I was like I'm not going.
Speaker 5:like I'm going to ocean Like beautiful by the sea.
Speaker 4:And I had a great GP, so it was like I could argue my way at anything. So I was. I was just very socially awkward And when I did speak, it just was unfiltered. I learned how to, you know, be quick-witted because I was around people that like if you weren't or if you cried, we laughed harder. So what wound up happening for me, luckily, was learning how to love the fact that I had no filter. And it was difficult at times, and it still sometimes is.
Speaker 4:But there has been times where like yes, because even as an actor or putting yourself out there or anything, to show up in any space and be like I'm not perfect, it's been a beautiful thing where I've gotten to kind of go you know what?
Speaker 4:sometimes I say things and I put my foot in my mouth and that's okay, cause I know I can say I'm sorry today, right, and sometimes I'm going to post things and damn, that might've come from a trauma or I maybe was a little unhealed on that one. Okay, Tomorrow I'll do a little better. But it's authentic and you can adjust, you can learn, you can grow, and for me it's mostly been about learning to stop shaming and shaming myself and shaming others and just kind of pausing a little bit more and going what do I want to share? What am I feeling in this moment? Do I need to process it first and then do it? But absolutely, i mean, it's still something I battle with today. Before I post things, i have a coach. I have my own coaches and my own therapists. Sometimes I'll screenshot my stuff and I'll send it to them, because I can.
Speaker 4:I question myself and I have a team that helps me with going. You're okay, natalie, you're safe Cause I didn't grow up with safety. I didn't grow up with learning what I could do or couldn't do, and there was a lot of bullying and there was trauma and there was this and that. So sometimes that little girl comes out and it's not sure if I'm safe to be vulnerable.
Speaker 4:One of my biggest fears was that, like, if I expose myself and I'm vulnerable, then I'll get attacked and that I could put my family in jeopardy And it would cause me to hide, not post online, not even tell people. When I had a movie coming out, well, a lot of people online didn't even know I was an actress and I have like films that you can see on like Amazon. Um, i would be on a TV show and people would be like why am I seeing you on burn notice? and you didn't tell me I was like I was hiding because my limiting belief, my, my trauma that turned into a limiting belief, was I'm not safe. So what I did was I isolated, i pulled back and I didn't share myself with you, and that's not fair. That's not fair to the people that love me. It was finding that balance of being here feeling safe to share this vulnerability and Finding out my boundaries of who and to whom I share those vulnerabilities with, and when and how. So still an ongoing thing that I get to grow in every day.
Speaker 3:But that's the gift of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think it's really important. Yeah, choose who you share your.
Speaker 5:But it's your, but it's your growth.
Speaker 3:And then you are growing and that you see, and and and Recognize your boundaries, like I think that's also like you said, that's so important. You have to have them you do and in whatever case, but just Knowing about it and stepping foot each and every day to make that next day a little bit better and learn a little bit more, i think it's. I think it's amazing.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it's funny, the different personalities. Like you know, we talk about being unfiltered and actually talks about being unfiltered You definitely know what she's thinking. I I envy that. I love that because with me I'm always saying, okay, is this the right thing to say? I'll read this and reread it again. I would love to. I wish I was less filtered. I would have removed my filters. I think it's great to be unfiltered.
Speaker 4:Yeah, sometimes I got both in me where I'm like I just said that thing. But, we got, you got on it now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, i know, you're kind of always like. I'm always like, oh crap, i should. I said that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, i definitely have both as well, but it was only in my 40s that I started to build boundaries. I don't think I ever did that before, and it was only really when I got into my 40s and I started to get a bit comfortable And go no, it was okay. I actually don't have to tell everybody everything about me. I can, i don't have to. It's not that you're not authentic, it's just choosing who to be authentic with the beauty of life.
Speaker 3:Is that you got to learn about the boundaries.
Speaker 5:Who do you trust like right I?
Speaker 1:don't know if.
Speaker 3:I learned that when I was in my 20s.
Speaker 5:If it would mean as much to me as it does now, Oh no because it takes on a whole different meaning because everybody's been hurt by now, like we're right here. So we're like, yeah, no, i'm in the boundaries. What?
Speaker 3:irritated or pissed me off in my 20s. Now I'm like are you kidding me? Yeah, like whatever, yeah. And now, like when I get hurt, like you were talking about, like I do know that it matters And now I can talk about it where what could have hurt me way back when is ridiculous. Yeah, i'm sorry, did you like? look at me wrong.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and now it's I did that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's like more substantial, It's like no, actually core thing. Yeah, that that is bad and we are gonna talk about it. So I do think that is one of the beauties of getting older.
Speaker 4:Yes, yes, such a good part. I mean even for me, like when I was aware of some boundaries, i just skipped right over on a few more times to that guy. That just gets real fun Watching. I'm watching, as this is not a good idea, and I'm doing, but I'm doing about to have a lesson here.
Speaker 5:I'm gonna go all in or something that is not a good idea, you always regret it. You always look back and you're like why don't that boundary down? Why do that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yes, but you knew you were doing it at the time. Yeah, yeah, or is that just my life?
Speaker 4:No, yeah, i did. There was, there were times right and I don't, i wouldn't have, i wouldn't have learned the things that I needed to in order to be the artist, i am the filmmaker I am or the coach that I am, without going through those things It just wouldn't have, because I I'll hear it in coaching every day. I'm like oh yeah, I did that twice on a Tuesday.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you'll be fine.
Speaker 4:Do this and this. Call me tomorrow. You'll be good, you know, because it's it's. It's that we go through things and then our experience, strength and hope Helps another person feel like they're not alone.
Speaker 5:Yes, yeah Well, you came in a relationship, though without being vulnerable. It's just like figuring out how you, you know, let that vulnerability out and to whom like who? who are you gonna like trust with those things?
Speaker 1:Yeah oh yeah, i'm just thankful I'm not talented or a singer or an actress. I would be devastated if I had people post things.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's horrible. It's horrible.
Speaker 4:It's yeah, it hurts like you'll see things and it's like like I've gone on lives And I've jumped on lives before and I've had amazing community and support and and then all, then you'll have your trolls, yeah, and And it's like people just don't. I will say I think Mike Tyson did say it best back in the day, like he didn't do those things as often, because there are consequences, yeah.
Speaker 5:But I think, people, you're right that you'll see the 95% of like positive percent.
Speaker 3:Yeah, just like, like you'll have, like you said, like you'll have so many amazing things and like, even like friends, like Experiences, like it's so positive. But you have that one Naysayer. Yes, it's the and like. Why is that in our subconscious that that's the nugget, mm-hmm.
Speaker 5:That's negative, that you want to turn around like you want to get someone who you could like, you know? Oh no, you see it see that I'm like nice, I'm great.
Speaker 3:I'm right, yes, i know there's usually an insecurity there though.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's the reason why yeah, i hear it because if it wasn't already a seed planted from like childhood or something that you went through, that you Or that you're still healing on I'm, it wouldn't bother you. Oh, it would be like oh, my god, this is nothing. But when it's something that, like on Like one time, being authentic for me is really important and just kind of you know, owning that, when I was on alive and someone was like, can anyone see that I had a troll, someone's like can't anyone see that She's so fake and inauthentic, and I was like I Felt some type of way about it and I realized it came from way before him, and so it was an opportunity for me to just feel it afterwards.
Speaker 4:I actually spoke on it during the live And I had a lot of people that you know got to show up in it. Um, and then I just sat with it afterwards and I was like, is that my truth? Do I? have there been times where I've been inauthentic or had to be a chameleon? Yeah, yeah, okay, can I, can I honor that side of me too? that right all get to be chameleon sometimes? Yeah, right, it was like this beautiful thing. That was like I have a trigger here, i have a wound here, so what can I do about it? to kind of nurture that wound and reframe it? But, yeah, and, and then that way, next time someone comes on and says something like that, i'm usually just gonna know, or you're, you're seeing their wounds project, right, yeah, right, the only time I ever clapped back at a troll.
Speaker 2:Oh, it was the most ridiculous thing. I had just moved here And I just had my son and I was them what you call the person who's in charge of a parade here Yeah, yeah, for the parade in Peach Tree City. I was so excited and I've got a red dress and everything. Everything was great. And there was a picture of me and this, this man. He just posted on a gun. She's obviously enjoying way too much of that southern food And it was just like red rag to a bull and I was okay with it. I just had a baby and I was like but you know, it always hurts anyway, but that was fine.
Speaker 2:So I decided firstly I'd look at his profile picture. That was neither here to there. I clapped back at him. This really nice like text going. You know it's okay for like, you shouldn't say things like that, because what if you got somebody who wasn't as confident as I am And it's just not like. I tried my best to be like very nice, but to the point I he responded back on I can't believe you responded. Michelle Obama didn't respond to what I said it to her. So that's just what he does. What time it was just what he did. Yeah, i'm like Honey miserable must.
Speaker 3:I was like that's a sad, oh his profile picture.
Speaker 2:He's like sitting there with no shirt on with his belly.
Speaker 4:Projecting.
Speaker 5:But it's so easy to be mean. Like that where it's like you know, i could just like text you and say what is it?
Speaker 3:the keyboard warriors?
Speaker 4:Yes, Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm.
Speaker 3:John, I've definitely clapped back in my dm Oh yeah, well, i do think that, like you were talking about, like, at the end of the day, we are still human. Yeah, we're evolving and we're working on ourselves and, you know, just Moving forward in a positive way, but at the end of the day, there there are moments where we are just still We know, yeah, we feel and we can push back and say things that you know the next day you're like. Well, that wasn't the most gracious thing.
Speaker 1:But it is what it is, you know. I mean, yeah, what I love about these podcasters that we they are always unscripted, i know we. But I love just the direction it goes, because this has been such a great conversation with your, i feel like you should be here with This all the time.
Speaker 4:I know, last I didn't know what to expect, but you guys are absolutely amazing Because we've just I mean, it's true, it's all real, it's all about being real.
Speaker 1:It's all about trying to find confidence. It's all about strengthening ourselves, becoming becoming better being better and you know just communication, and so it's just. I just love the direction these all, because we never know which direction they're gonna go.
Speaker 3:I know it is funny because I mean we've had a cup you know, wanted to like kind of get this group. We're like there is no script.
Speaker 4:Hey what.
Speaker 3:I'm like No there's no.
Speaker 1:Just goes where it goes because you have such a dynamic background and you know you're an actress, your filmmaker, you're a life coach, a dating coach, but really you're just, you're real you're a person. You're human and have life experiences, and so I think that's the greatest thing to learn from is just talking to the. The real you, yeah, yes for sharing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we appreciate it, thank you for the questions and everyone that asked those questions too. Like I love this, i do love showing up and just seeing like hey, i'm here and I'm present and I'm just down to see what happens. And that comes with like also Just learning how to trust yourself a little more too, and again, you know, foot and mouth, that happens. but yeah, yeah, my name is.
Speaker 1:Ashley, when we put out this podcast, i'm definitely gonna put your link there for your website because I think you would be just amazing to talk with you. We're great to talk with the night, so we really appreciate your time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, thank you for. Yeah, Thank you for what you do and being you. Thank you.
Speaker 4:There's so much, thank you.
Speaker 1:Have a good night.
Speaker 3:Thanks so much, she was super cool, yes absolutely, she's authentic and she's she's real. I know I felt her energy like literally came through.
Speaker 1:I felt like she's just one of us, just sitting, talking about you know, just Life and your feelings and being genuine.
Speaker 3:I do. I think her energy is amazing. Yeah, i just think the more people that can that find their true self like, even when you struggle, because that's part of it. But her whole theory of just being authentic, Working through the trauma, figuring out what the trauma is because we all have reasons why we react or we do certain things even at this age Yeah well, you have to be vulnerable and then have boundaries.
Speaker 5:So there's like right, there's both, and you have to figure out Who could I acknowledge like?
Speaker 3:acknowledge what those triggers. You know, because sometimes people think trauma means Something horrific and it does sometimes like absolutely, but trauma can be many different things and I think that that's one of the like really good things that I'm learning is that it doesn't like, it doesn't have to be something like what we associate that word with, but it is what Happens that has made us who we are and what triggers us and how we need to Fix that or work on it. Um, so I love, i love the ones that we get to talk to that are just raw and Everything looks amazing on the outside, but they're like yeah, no, uh-uh like this everyone has their own stuff, right.
Speaker 3:I think it's encouraging.
Speaker 1:Well, here's to being real and be a better I know first being authentic and taking this journey together Cheers, cheers.
